>> TONIGHT, DEMOCRATIC SOCIALISM ON THE RISE ALSO TONIGHT, WHY ARE WE CELEBRATING AMERICA 250?

AND, STATES WANT TO BAN CERTAIN FOOD STAMP PURCHASES.

LET'S UNPACK IT ALL,ON "IVORY TOWER" COMING UP NEXT.

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> GOOD EVENING, EVERYBODY.

THANKS FOR JOINING US.

I'M NINA MOORE OF COLGATE UNIVERSITY.

AROUND THE TABLE WITH ME TONIGHT, THE "IVORY TOWER" PROFESSORS.

SARAH PRALLE OF SYRACUSE UNIVERSITY LUKE PERRY OF UTICA UNIVERSITY MICHAEL TILLOTSON OF SUNY CORTLAND AND ANIRBAN ACHRYA OF LEMOYNE COLLEGE.

SOCIALIST HAVE BEEN WINNING DEMOCRATIC PRIMARIES ACROSS THE COUNTRY THIS YEAR FROM NEW YORK AND THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA TO LOS ANGELES AND SEATTLE.

TONIGHT, WE WANNA TAKE A DEEP DIVE INTO WHY THIS IS HAPPENING AND WHAT IT MEANS FOR THE FUTURE OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY, FOR THE UPCOMING MIDTERM ELECTIONS, AND FOR THE COUNTRY AS A WHOLE.

SO, ANIRBAN, WHAT ARE YOUR MAIN TAKEAWAYS FROM THIS SURGE OF WINS?

>> YOU KNOW, THE RECENT EVENTS REMINDS ME OF THIS QUOTE, IT SAYS THAT THERE ARE DECADES WHEN NOTHING HAPPENS AND WEEKS WHEN DECADES HAPPEN AND THIS IS ONE OF THE CASES WHERE I FEEL THAT THAT KIND OF SITUATION HAS HAPPENED.

LOOK, A LOT OF-- I WILL NOT GO INTO THE DETAILS OF EVERY ELECTION THAT HAS HAPPENED, BUT LET ME JUST START BY SAYING THAT IF YOU LOOK AT THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY BASE, A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE KIND OF REALLY FED UP WITH THIS KIND OF NORMIE CORPORATE DEMOCRATS WHO CANNOT GIVE A CLEAR ANSWER TO ANYTHING, CANNOT STAND UP AGAINST WHAT ISRAEL IS DOING, AND CANNOT EVEN GIVE AN ANSWER WITHOUT LIKE FOUR DIFFERENT POLITICAL HANDLERS AND SEVEN PILOT GROUPS.

RIGHT?

THEY COME OUT TO BE COMPLETELY FAKE.

INCREASINGLY THE DEMOCRATIC BASE IS SAYING THEY CAN'T RELY ON THESE PEOPLE.

THEY DON'T HAVE ANY SOLUTIONS FOR AUTHORITARIANISM, AFFORDABILITY, CLIMATE CHANGE, AND PEOPLE ARE FED UP.

SO THEY ARE RATHER PIVOTING, GRAVITATING TOWARDS CANDIDATES THAT ARE NOT JUST AGAINST SOMETHING BUT SAYING WE ARE FOR SOMETHING.

WE ARE GOING TO DO THESE THINGS AND THEY'RE VERY CLEAR EYED.

THEY'RE VERY PLAIN SPOKEN.

THEY DON'T EQUIVOCATE.

AND AT THE SAME TIME, YES, SOCIALISTS BUT AT THE SAME TIME YOU CAN SEE THIS ONLY ONE RACE I'LL TALK ABOUT THE BRAD LANDER VERSUS DAN GOLDMAN RACE IN A PREDOMINANTLY JEWISH DISTRICT WHERE GOLDMAN TOOK IPAC MONEY AND GOT TROUNCED LIKE 34% TO LANDRY'S 65%.

AND THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT FOR DEMOCRATS TO UNDERSTAND THIS.

THAT RECENT POLLS HAVE SHOWN THAT WHEN PEOPLE ASK, DEMOCRATIC VOTERS ARE ASKED, CAN YOU TRUST A CANDIDATE WHO HAS TAKEN IPAC MONEY TO BE TRUSTFUL AND 70% TO 80% SAID NO.

WE CANNOT TRUST THEM IN ANY OTHER ISSUES.

SO I THINK THAT'S WHERE WE ARE AT.

>> SO BEFORE WE GET TO HOW LARGELY ISRAEL FIGURED IN THESE RACES, I WANT TO STICK FIRST ABOUT TALKING ABOUT SOCIALISM.

ANIRBAN, MICHAEL TALKED ABOUT THE DEMOCRATIC BASE.

THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS THE REST OF THE COUNTRY IS NOT SUPPORTIVE OF SOCIALISM.

JUST TWO DAYS AGO MARQUETTE UNIVERSITY RELEASED A POLL THAT SHOWED THAT FEWER THAN A THIRD OF AMERICANS ARE SUPPORTIVE.

>> IN APPRECIATION OF EVERYTHING ANIRBAN SHARED WITH US, I THINK IT IS PREMATURE TO CALL IT A RISE OTHER THAN NEW YORK CITY.

WE HAVE SEEN MISTAKES BEING MADE.

SHEVALIR IN THE 13th DISTRICT PUSHING FOR ABOLISHMENT.

POLICE AND PRISON.

THINKING ABOUT 2028, HOW WILL THIS PLAY IN INDIANA, IOWA AND MISSOURI, THE MOST PROGRESSIVE EVEN, DEMOCRATS HAVE TO GET REAL AND STOP ALL THESE PIE IN THE SKY NOVELTY APPROACHES AND STICK TO BREAD AND BURT COALITION BUILDING AMONG EVERYDAY FOLKS.

THE LIKES OF ANDY BESHEAR, GROW UP DEMOCRATS, THINK ABOUT THE LONG GAME.

IF YOU ARE GOING TO PLAY, PLAY TO WIN AND GET THE CONCESSIONS LATER ON.

>> I WAS GOING TO SAY THIS AN INTERESTING CONVERSATION BECAUSE IT REFLECTS WHAT IS GOING ON WITHIN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY.

SHOULD DEMOCRATS PRIORITIZE STRATEGY AND MORE MODERATE APPROACH TO TRY TO WIN ELECTIONS IN COMPETITIVE AREAS OR SPEAK THEIR MIND?

I THINK MOST DEMOCRATS ARE PROGRESSIVE.

THEY DON'T USE THAT LABEL, EVEN SOME OF THE DEMOCRATS YOU JUST MENTIONED, MICHAEL, BECAUSE THEY DON'T WANT TO FACE THE POLITICAL BACKLASH.

THIS IS EMBLEMATIC OF THE LARGER CONVERSATION.

WHAT STANDS OUT TO ME THIS IS AN ANTI-INCUMBENT MOMENT.

IT IS ON BOTH SIDES.

PARTICULARLY THAT CASE FOR THE DEMOCRATS BECAUSE REPUBLICANS SWEPT TO POWER IN WASHINGTON AND THE DEMOCRATS ARE LOOKING AT THEIR LEADERS SAYING WHAT HAPPENED?

WE CAN DO BETTER.

AND I UNDERSTAND THAT.

>> AND ONE OF THE THINGS WE'VE HEARD, SARAH, TO LUKE'S POINT IS THAT EVEN LEADERS, WHEN HAKEEM JEFFRIES SUPPORTED THE OTHER CANDIDATE, THE OPPOSITE CANDIDATE WON AND SO WE ARE TALKING ABOUT MAMDANI AS POTENTIALLY A KING MAKER.

SO YOUR THOUGHTS ABOUT HOW THEY WERE ABLE TO CAPITALIZE ON THE DISCONTENT THAT LUKE TALKED ABOUT.

>> WE ARE IN AN ANTIESTABLISHMENT KIND OF MOMENT, RIGHT?

AND DEMOCRATS ARE SORT OF SAYING THAT ALL OVER THE COUNTRY, RIGHT?

AND I THINK WHAT IS USEFUL AND ABOUT THIS MOMENT IS THAT DEMOCRATS ARE BEING LESS RISK AVERSE, AS KIND OF ANIRBAN MENTIONED, RIGHT.

THEY'RE SPEAKING PLAINLY.

THEY'RE TAKING RISKS.

THEY'RE TRYING OTHER STRATEGIES, WHICH THEY HAVE TO BECAUSE, FRANKLY, THE DEMOCRATIC BRAND NAME IS NOT POPULAR, RIGHT?

AND SO WHATEVER THEY'RE DOING UP TO THIS POINT HAS NOT BEEN WORKING, RIGHT.

AND GETTING BACK TO YOUR QUESTION ABOUT SOCIALISM, THE LABEL MIGHT NOT BE THAT POPULAR ALTHOUGH TWO-THIRDS OF DEMOCRATS SAY THEY HAVE A POSITIVE VIEW OF SOCIALISM.

AND REMEMBER THESE WERE PRIMARIES, DEMOCRATIC PRIERMT.

AND ALSO A LOT OF THE KINDS OF POLICIES THAT THEY'RE USUAL PUSHING THE ECONOMIC POLICIES ARE QUITE POPULAR ACROSS THE BOARD.

HIGHER MINIMUM WAGES, OTHER KINDS OF SOCIAL SAFETY NETS, INVESTMENT IN THE WORKING CLASS.

AND THESE ARE ISSUES THAT SPAN AND BIPARTISAN OFTEN TIMES AND IF THEY CONTINUE TO FOCUS ON THESE BREAD AND BUTTER ECONOMIC ISSUES, I THINK THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE, BE ABLE TO BUILD A BROADER COALITION.

>> SO THAT'S PART OF THE ISSUE, RIGHT, IS WHAT EXACTLY DOES THE SOCIALISM OF TODAY CONSIST OF BECAUSE IF YOU LOOK AT DIFFERENT POLLS YOU SEE DIFFERENT LEVELS OF SUPPORT.

ONE THING WE KNOW FOR SURE, ANIRBAN, IT'S YOUNG PEOPLE THAT TEND TO VIEW SOCIALISM MORE FAVORABLY.

IS THAT A WINNING FORMULA GIVEN THE FACT THAT YOUNG PEOPLE ARE THE LEAST LIKELY DEMOGRAPHIC TO VOTE?

>> YES, SO YOUNG PEOPLE, THE VISIBILTY OF THE YOUNG PEOPLE ARE LARGE.

BUT THERE IS A VERY STRONG TRADITION OF BLACK SOCIALISTS, BLACK SOCIALISM IN THE UNITED STATES.

THERE IS BLACK AGENDA REPORT IS ONE OF THE PLACES I GO AND LISTEN TO.

>> I WILL HAVE TO GO AND LISTEN TO THAT.

>> BLACK AGENDA REPORT IS EXCELLENT.

THEY'RE A VERY STRONG TRADITION OF LATINOS, YOU KNOW, SOCIALIST IS A BROAD CAMP.

IN SHORT WHAT IT MEANS IS THE WORKING CLASS SHOULD HAVE A FAIR SHARE OF THE WEALTH GENERATED IN THE SOCIETY.

THAT'S PRETTY MUCH IT.

AND IF YOU SEE REPUBLICAN PODCASTERS ON THE RIGHT ALMOST SAY A SIMILAR THING THAT MANY PEOPLE IN THE SOCIALIST LEFT ARE SAYING, RIGHT?

SO THAT'S WHY YOU DON'T SEE TRUMP ATTACKING BERNIE SANDERS.

THERE IS A REASON FOR THAT.

BECAUSE THERE IS SOME COMMONALITY WITHIN THESE TWO COALITIONS THAT SEE THAT THERE IS A HUGE AMOUNT OF WEALTH BEING GENERATED AND NOT MUCH OF THAT IS BEING SHARED WITH THE WORKING CLASS.

AND THAT, I THINK, WILL BE THE MOST IMPORTANT THING THERE.

>> YEAH, WE DO HAVE TO GET TO A COUPLE OF OTHER THINGS.

ONE OF WHICH, MICHAEL, IS THAT WE ARE REALLY TALKING ABOUT FEWER THAN A DOZEN WINS AND MOSTLY IN COASTAL STATES, RIGHT?

WHICH ARE THE BLUEST OF BLUE STATES.

SO DOES THAT SAY ANYTHING MORE AS ANIRBAN IS SUGGESTING?

ANYTHING MORE THAN THE FACT THAT THIS IS WHAT BLUE STATES DO?

>> 18-3 ON-YEAR-OLD DEMOCRATIC IS VERY UNRELIABLE AND UNDEPENDABLE.

I WOULDN'T HANG MY HAT ON THAT.

WHY DO WE HAVE TO PUT A TAG ON IT.

IT GIVES THE OTHER SIDE MEAT TO CHEW ON.

THERE IS NO NUANCE IN TODAY'S WORLD.

>> WE ARE GOING TO MOVE ON NOW.

OVER THE NEXT WEEK, AS A COUNTRY, WE WILL CELEBRATE A MAJOR MILESTONE.

AMERICA'S 250th.

WHAT BEGAN AS AN EXPERIMENT IN SELF GOVERNANCE AND FREEDOM HAS EVOLVED INTO ONE OF THE MOST POWERFUL COUNTRIES IN THE WORLD.

BUT IS IT A COUNTRY THAT REMAINS FAITHFUL TO ITS FOUNDING PRINCIPLES?

THE PRINCIPLES THAT ARE LAID OUT IN THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE AND THE PREAMBLE TO THE CONSTITUTION.

MICHAEL, WHY DON'T WE START WITH YOU.

HOW DO YOU ASSESS FAITHFULNESS TO THE ORIGINAL PRINCIPLES?

>> IN TERMS OF FIDELITY, I THINK THAT THE AMERICAN IDEAL IS ASPIRATIONAL STILL.

IT LOOKS VERY GOOD ON PAPER, RIGHT?

IN THIS MOMENT WHAT ARE WE CELEBRATING?

THE CANNIBALIZING OF THE VOTING RIGHTS ACT, DESTRUCTION OF FREE SPEECH, EROSION OF SACRED INSTITUTION, TACK ON RESEARCH INSTITUTION, PUNISHMENT FOR EXERCISING THE RIGHT TO PROTEST.

TURN BACK ON THE WORD COULD LOSSES US.

AT THE BOTTOM OF THE STATUE OF LIBERTY.

WHAT ARE WE DEL GREATING?

THE DEMISE OF THE SUPREME COURT INTO A FOOT SERVANT FOR THE PERSONAL IDEOLOGIES FOR HAND PICKED ANTIEGALITARIAN SUPER MARRIAGE TEARIAN JUSTICE.

WHAT ARE WE CELEBRATING?

246 YEARS OF UNSALARIED LABOR BY AFRICAN PEOPLE.

MAY HAVES STAPLES SAID IN THE SONG, WHEN WILL WE BE PAID FOR THE WORK WE HAVE DONE.

>> I DO REMEMBER THAT.

>> SARAH, I THINK ABOUT WHAT WE MEAN BY WE THE PEOPLE.

IT'S AN AGE OLD PEOPLE, WHO IS INCLUDED IN THAT WE AND HOW DO YOU SORT OF BECOME AN AMERICAN AND AT THE MAXWELL SCHOOL, WE TALK A LOT ABOUT THIS.

AND WE ASK OUR STUDENTS THAT.

DO THEY BELIEVE IN A KIND OF CREEDAL NATION WHERE ANYONE CAN WK A NATION IF THEY AGREE TO THE FUNDAMENTAL VALUES OF LIBERTY AND EQUALITY.

OR DO YOU HAVE TO HAVE SOME KIND OF OTHER CULTURAL, YOU FLOW, STAMP YOU KNOW, STAMP ON YOU WHETHER IT'S BEING A CHRISTIAN OR HAVING ANCESTORS BORN IN THE UNITED STATES, ET CETERA.

AND THAT'S A HUGE DEBATE RIGHT NOW, I BELIEVE, BETWEEN THE LEFT AND THE RIGHT.

AND SO, YOU KNOW, IT'S ASPIRATIONAL AS MICHAEL WAS SAYING, THE KIND OF CREEDAL IDEA IS THAT YOU CAN OPT IN TO BECOME AN AMERICAN, RIGHT?

AND THAT'S WHAT OUR STRENGTH IS, IS TRYING TO BUT FAILING OFTEN BUT ATTEMPTING TO LIVE UP TO THAT POTENTIAL CREED.

BUT I WOULD ALSO SAY AS SOMEONE WHO STUDIES ENVIRONMENTALISM, A PART THAT I THINK ABOUT IS THE LAND ITSELF, WHICH IS NOT REALLY OFTEN TIMES WHAT WE THINK OF WHEN WE THINK OF THESE FOUNDING DOCUMENTS, BUT CLEARLY, YOU KNOW, SOMING THAT MAKES AMERICA GREAT, I THINK, IS THE INCREDIBLE GEOGRAPHY AND ECOSYSTEMS AND THE ATTEMPTS THROUGH THE DECADES AND CENTURIES TO PRESERVE THOSE BEAUTIFUL AREAS.

THE OLD EUROPE HAS ITS ROMAN RUINS, GREEK RUINS, BUT WE HAVE YELLOWSTONE AND WE HAVE THE GRAND CANYON.

AND THAT'S SOMETHING WE NEED TO PRESERVE FOR FUTURE GENERATIONS AS WELL.

>> WHEN I THINK OF THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE AND WHAT WE ARE CELEBRATING, I THINK OF THE THINGS THAT WERE MENTIONED, THE GREAT CHALLENGES THAT REMAIN IN AMERICA AND THE IDEA THAT ANYBODY CAN BECOME AMERICAN AND CONTRIBUTE TO AMERICAN SOCIETY POSITIVELY.

I ALSO THINK OF THE POLITICAL PRINCIPLES.

WE THINK OF AMERICA AS THE LAND OF THE THREE AND FREEDOM AND THAT'S IMPORTANT, AND YES THAT'S IMPORTANT BUT THE OTHER KEY POLITICAL PRINCIPLE IN THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE IS EQUALITY.

IN MY RESEARCH THE COMMON THREAD IS DEMOCRACY.

EVEN THOUGH THE PEOPLE WHO WROTE THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENTS AND CREATED THE CONSTITUTION WERE BRILLIANT AND ALSO VERY FLAWED IN A LOT OF WAYS, THE IDEAS THEY PUT FORTH, I THINK, PUT US ON A TRAJECTORY TO EXPAND DEMOCRACY.

AND AS MICHAEL MENTIONED, DEMOCRACY IS FRAGILE AND IT'S NOT GUARANTEED BUT WHEN I LOOK BACK OVER THE PAST TWO CENTURIES WE HAVE SEEN A STRUGGLE FOR EQUALITY AND STRUGGLE FOR DEMOCRACY AND THE LEADERS WHO LED THOSE DIFFERENT MOMENTS AT DIFFERENT TIMES ALWAYS HARKEN BACK TO THE PRINCIPLES OF THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT ENDURES AND COMES TO MIND WHEN WE CELEBRATE NEXT WEEK.

>> THIS IS VERY PERSONAL TO ME.

IN 2004 WHEN LOTS OF CHAOS IS GOING ON IN INDIA IN TERMS OF FREE SPEECH AND WHAT YOU CAN SAY AGAINST THE BEHIND U RIGHT, I CAME TO THE UNITED STATES AS A Ph.D.

STUDENT AND I WAS SO FASCINATED TO SEE JOHN STUART AND OTHER COMEDIANS OPENLY MAKING FUN OF THE PRESIDENT, OPENLY MAKING FUN OF JESUS AND IT WAS SUCH A FRESH BREATH OF FREEDOM, TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT WAS SOMETHING SO NOVEL TO ME.

AND I THINK THAT'S SO AIMPORTANT TO UNDERSTAND THE IMPORTANCE OF FREE SPEECH THAT WE HAVE IN THE UNITED STATES AND THAT IS NOT PRESENT IN MANY OTHER COUNTRIES IN THE WORLD.

EVEN IN ENGLAND, FOR EXAMPLE, IT IS CORDONED OFF.

IT'S NOT AS SACK RESAINGT AS OUR FIRST AMENDMENT HERE AND I THINK THAT BEING ERODED NOW SEEMS TO BE SCARY TO ME IN CERTAIN WAYS IN 20 YEARS I'M SEEING THAT, OH, YOU FOE, COMEDIANS ARE GETTING IT CANCEL ON TV BECAUSE THE PRESIDENT DOESN'T LIKE THIS.

THERE ARE A COUPLE OF PLACES I THINK SOME IMPROVEMENT COULD BE DONE HERE.

ONE IS TO MITIGATE THE DAMAGES OF CITIZENS UNITED.

WE NEED TO TAKE THIS CORPORATE MONEY OUT OF POLITICS.

WE SHOULD WORK TOWARDS THAT.

MAYBE REVISE THE 13th AMENDMENT TO SAY THAT, YOU KNOW, YOU SHOULD NOT BE SUBJECTED TO SLAVERY EVEN IF YOU ARE YOU KNOW, CONVICTED OF A CRIME.

I WILL END BY SAYING ONE OF THE BIGGEST INFLUENCE OF AMERICA ON ME IS AMERICAN MUSIC, LIKE JAZZ,RAP, I MEAN THAT'S GLOBAL AND I GREW UP WITH DIZZY GILLESPIE, MILES DAVIS, JOHN COLTRANE, LAIRD ON COOL HERC, DJ SHADOW AND ALL THESE BEAUTIFUL AMAZING PEOPLE.

WHAT MUSIC HAS DONE FOR THE ENTIRE WORLD.

>> I HAVE THIS ENDURING FAITH IN THE INSTITUTIONS GOING BACK TO WHAT LUKE WAS TALKING ABOUT.

AND CERTAINLY AS ANIRBAN MENTIONED, THE INSTITUTIONS, THE INSTITUTIONAL PROCESSES ARE SOMEWHAT UNDER ATTACK, RIGHT?

THEY'RE NOW BEING TESTED IF NOTHING ELSE.

COULD WE LOOK AT THIS AND REALLY ASK, IS IT POSSIBLE FOR JUST FOUR YEARS TO REALLY UNRAVEL SOMETHING THAT HAS BEEN IN PLACE FOR 250?

>> I THINK THE CURRENT ADMINISTRATION IS TAKING A REALLY GOOD SHOT AT IT.

BUT TO LUKE'S EXCELLENT SHOT POINT WHEN YOU SIT DOWN AND READ THE DOCUMENTS, THE DECLARATION AND BILL OF RIGHTS, YOU CAN GET TEARY EYED BECAUSE THESE WERE VERY WELL READ PEOPLE.

ESPECIALLY THOMAS JEFFERSON, HE READ SO MANY PEOPLE, VOLTAIRE AND RUE SO.

AT THE SAME TIME THESE ARE THE SAME PEOPLE THAT PUT PROFIT BEFORE PEOPLE, MONEY BEFORE MANKIND AND COMMERCE BEFORE CHRISTIANITY.

THEY CAN INTELLECT USE LIBERTY EXTREMELY WELL BUT COULD NOT EXERCISE FREEDOM BECAUSE THEY WERE ENGAGED IN THE PRACTICE OF HUMAN BONDAGE.

>> AND AS IT'S ALL ABOUT ASPIRATIONAL GOALS AND SO THE MARCH OF AMERICAN HISTORY ARGUABLY HAS BEEN A MARCH TOWARD GREATER EQUALITY, GREATER DEMOCRACY, GREATER PARTICIPATION AND INCLUSIVITY.

>> FASCINATING.

(ALL TALKING AT ONCE).

>> A MORE PERFECT TOWARD.

TOWARD A MORE PERFECT UNION.

>> THE AMERICAN IDEAL IS A WONDERFUL IDEAL.

>> IT IS A WONDERFUL THING.

WE WILL CELEBRATE IT.

NOW WE WILL TALK ABOUT BREAD AND BUTTER ISSUES.

THE APPLIES HERE SO I DON'T THINK THE JUDGE NECESSARILY ERRED IN MAKING THE RULING BUT I THINK IT'S IN THE PUBLIC INTEREST TO LIMIT THE PURCHASES CERTAIN FOODS THAT ARE UNHEALTHY IF YOU ARE USING SNAP BENEFITS, RIGHT.

WE ALL LIKE TO THINK OF OURSELVES AS RELATIVELY SMART.

I HAVE A PACKAGE OF SMARTEES HERE WITH ME.

IT IS SEVEN GRAMS IN WEIGHT, SIX GRAMS OF WHICH IS SUGAR AND THE OTHER ONE GRAM IS A BURCH OF STUFF CANNOT PRONOUNCE AND ARTIFICIAL DYES AND FLAVORING.

THE SUPPLEMENTAL NUTRITION ASSISTANCE PROGRAM IS FOCUSED ON SUPPLEMENTING NUTRITION.

SO I THINK THAT CANDY LIKE THIS IS NOT IN THE INTEREST OF PUBLIC MONEY SUBSIDIZING IT BECAUSE IT JEOPARDIZES PEOPLE'S HEALTH.

IT DOESN'T MEAN THEY DON'T HAVE THE FREEDOM TO BUY IT WITH OTHER FUNDS, FOR SURE, BUT I THINK WITH THIS PARTICULAR PROGRAM IT MAKES SENSE TO FOCUS ON NUTRITIOUS FOOD.

>> SHOULD IT BE UP TO THE BENEFICIARY TO, THE PERSON RECEIVING THE BENEFITS TO MAKE THAT DECISION OR ARE WE PATERNALLIZING THIS.

>> I DISAGREE WITH LUKE.

I SHARE THE INTEREST IN IMPROVING AMERICANS DIETS, RIGHT.

BUT WE ARE TARGETING LOWER INCOME PEOPLE, WE ARE SENDING A MESSAGE TO THEM SAYING BASICALLY WE DON'T TRUST YOU; THAT YOU CAN MAKE THE RIGHT DECISIONS FOR YOUR FAMILY AND WE ARE IGNORING THE WHOLE FOOD ENVIRONMENT IN WHICH THESE PEOPLE OFTEN, A LOT OF US LIVE, RIGHT?

WHICH IS BEING SURROUNDED BY HIGHLY PROCESSED SUGARY FOODS, WHERE FRUITS AND VEGETABLES ARE MORE EXPENSIVE OFTEN TIMES THAN A LOT OF THIS FAST FOOD AND PROCESSED FOOD.

THERE IS FOOD DESERTS PEOPLE DON'T HAVE ACCESS TO THAT.

AND SO THERE IS-- THIS IS A POLICY THAT SOUNDS, MIGHT SOUND GOOD ON PAPER OR REASONABLE.

IT DOESN'T EVEN WORK THAT WELL SO THE RESEARCH SHOWS THAT THERE IS A SLIGHT EFFECT ON PEOPLE'S FOOD HABITS IF YOU WERE TO BAN THESE THINGS, BUT SIGHTS INSIGNIFICANT STATISTICALLY.

AND THERE IS REALLY MIXED RESULTS, RIGHT?

AND THERE ARE OTHER INCENTIVE STYLE PROGRAMS THAT ACTUALLY WORK BETTER.

AND I THINK THIS IS A WAY OF, YOU KNOW, STIGMATIZING WHAT SHOULD BE A PROGRAM THAT IS FREELY GIVEN TO PEOPLE BECAUSE THEY'RE HUNGRY, RIGHT?

SO IF WE WANT PEOPLE TO EAT HEALTHY, MAYBE INCREASE SNAP BENEFITS SO THEY HAVE THE MONEY TO BUY HEALTHIER FOODS.

INSTEAD WE ARE KICKING PEOPLE OFF SNAP.

>> YEAH, THE EXACT OPPOSITE.

SO, ANIRBAN, THE SECRETARY OF THE DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE SAID THAT TAXPAYERS SHOULD NOT FOOT THE BILL FOR JUNK FOOD.

AND WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT WEST VIRGINIA, WHICH I KNOW WE ALL THINK ABOUT ALL THE TIME, RIGHT.

IT'S NUMBER ONE IN TERMS OF THE RATE OF OBESITY AND IT'S POPULATION IS ONE OF THE STATES.

SO ISN'T IT THE JOB OF GOVERNMENT TO PROVIDE FOR THE COMMON WELFARE AND SUPPORT NUTRITION, NOT JUNK FOOD?

>> I THINK THERE IS A PLACE TO RECONCILE WHAT SARAH AND LUKE SAID, YES, TO ONE EXTENT JUNK FOOD IS BAD FOR EVERYONE BUT THE PROBLEM IS WHEN YOU START DEFINING IT, IT BECOMES THIS VERY DIFFICULT THING TO DEFINE.

NO SUGAR, NO CANDY FINE BUT WHAT IF I DRINK AN ICED TEA, IS THAT OKAY?

IS THAT A SUGARY DRINK BECAUSE IT HAS SUGAR IN IT?

CAN I GET A CAKE, TIRAMISU?

THAT'S FULL OF SUGAR.

SO IT BECOMES VERY DIFFICULT TO ACTUATE IT IN REAL LIFE TO DEFINE IT IN THAT WAY BUT I ALSO THINK THERE SHOULD BE ADDITIONS TO IT; FOR EXAMPLE, I KNEW RECENTLY THAT HOT FOOD IS NOT ALLOWED TO BUY ON SNAP.

THERE IS A NEW ACT THAT IS COMING UP, JUST PASSED THE HOUSE CALLED THE HOT ROTISSERIE CHICKEN ACT WHEREBY PEOPLE CAN BUY ROTISSERIE CHICKEN AND OTHER HOT FOOD WITH THEIR SNAP BENEFITS.

I AGREE THAT, YOU KNOW, WE SHOULD NOT, YOU KNOW, IF IT'S SUPPLEMENTAL NUTRITION, WE SHOULD NOT BE PROVIDE INCENTIVES THAT YOU HAVE A LOT OF SUGAR IN YOUR DIET.

BUT AT THE SAME TIME, CUTTING IT OFF, I DON'T THINK IT'S POSSIBLE BECAUSE THERE ARE SO MANY DIFFERENT WAYS YOU CAN MOVE AROUND WITH IT AND SECONDLY IT IS PATERNALISTIC.

WIC IS ONE OF THOSE EXAMPLES.

WIC ONES VERY WELL BUT STRINGENT.

>> I'M NOT ACCEPTING ANYTHING THAT COMES FROM THE SO CALLED MAKE AMERICA HEALTHY.

IT SHOULD BE CALLED MAKE AMERICA SICK AGAIN.

>> QUICKLY.

>> 2200 CONFIRMED CASES OF MEASLES ACROSS THE UNITED STATES, ROUGHLY 93% WERE UNVAICTED.

SO CALLED HEALTH SECRETARY KENNEDY STOPPED THE FLU VACCINATION.

: THIS IS THE SAME GUY WHO SAID HE LICKED COCAINE OFF TOILET SEATS BECAUSE HE WAS NOT AFRAID OF GERMS.

WE ARE LIVING IN THE TWILIGHT ZONES IN TERMS OF HEALTH.

>> IT IS TIME FOR OUR GRADE BOOKS.

STARTING WITH FS, AND WE'LL COME BACK TO YOUR OTHER F MICHAEL IN A MOMENT BUT SARAH, YOU FIRST.

>> MY FIRST GOES TO DAVID STEINER, POSTMASTER GENERAL WHO TOLD CONGRESS THIS WEEK THE POSTAL SERVICE WOULD NOT DELIVER MAIL-IN BALLOTS IN STATES THAT DECLINE TO HAND OVER THEIR ABSENTEE VOTER LIST.

THIS COULD AFFECT MILLIONS OF AMERICANS WHO RELY ON MAIL BLOTTING BALLOTING AND TRUMP IS TRYING TO INTERVENE WITH ELECTIONS AND PROTECT HIMSELF FROM AN EMGASSERRING-- EMBARRASSING DEFEAT.

>> F TO EXTREME HEAT WE HAVE HAD RECORD HIGHS IN FRANCE, PAKISTAN, HUNDREDS OF DIED AND THOUSANDS HAVE LOST POWER.

>> MICHAEL.

>> F TO THE SUPREME COURT FOR RULING IN FAVOR OF THE BAYER CORPORATION STOPPING PEOPLE FROM BEING ABLE TO SUE AGAINST THE PESTICIDE ROUNDUP.

CANT MAYOR SHAME ON YOU.

>> THE LINCOLN MEMORIAL POOL GREEN WATER SOLUTIONS WHICH WAS GIVEN 1.7 MILLION CONTRACT AND ANOTHER WATER PURIFICATION AND THEN THE ATLANTIC INDUSTRIAL COATING WHICH WAS AWARDED $14.7 MILLION TO REPAINT THE POOL.

EVERYTHING IS GOING HAYWIRE AND THE POOL IS GREEN AND PAINT IS PEELING OFF.

GOOD JOB GUYS.

>> WE ALWAYS LEAVE YOU WITH GOOD NEWS.

WE ARE GOING TO LEAVE WITH YOU SOME ESPECIALLY GOOD NEWS TONIGHT STARTING AGAIN WITH SARAH.

>> WELL, MY A GOES TO A FEDERAL JUDGE IN MANHATTAN WHO ORDERED THE JUSTICE DEPARTMENT TO STOP SEEKING SENSITIVE MEDICAL INFORMATION ABOUT TRANSGENDER YOUTH WHO RECEIVED MEDICAL CARE.

THE JUSTICE'S EFFORTS TO GET THIS INFORMATION CONSTITUTE A REALLY APPALLING BREACH OF PRIVACY AND ARE PART OF A BROADER INVESTIGATION OR FISHING EXPEDITION INTO HOSPITALS AND MEDICAL PROVIDERS THAT PROVIDE GENDER TRANSITION CARE TO YOUNG PEOPLE IN AN EFFORT, IT SEEMS TO INTIMIDATE THEM.

LUKELY THEY WON'T BE ABLE TO DO THAT AS MUCH.

>> LUKE YOUR GOOD NEWS.

>> THE CITY OF UTICA WHO RECEIVED A $4 MILLION STATE GRANT TO RESTORE A FORMER MANUFACTURING SITE DOWNTOWN.

THE STATE GRANTS ARE SO VITAL TO CITIES LIKE UTICA BECAUSE OF NEARLY HALF OF THEIR LAND IN THE URBAN CORE ARE BROWN FIELDS.

>> MICHAEL.

>> MY A GOES TO PRESIDENT BA RAM OBAMA FOR HANDLING THE NON-STOP INSULTS LIKE AN ADULT.

KUDOS Mr.

PRESIDENT.

>> ANIRBAN.

>> MY A GOES TO THE SUSTAINED EFFORT BY THE MAMDANI ADMINISTRATION IN NEGOTIATING A DEAL WHERE THE OWNER OF MORE THAN 5,000 RENT STABILIZED APARTMENTS SAY THAT IT WILL AGREE TO WAIVE MILLIONS OF DOLLARS SOME UNPAID RENTS THAT TENANTS OWED FOR YEARS.

MANY TENANTS WERE WITHHOLDING YEARS BECAUSE OF UNSAFE CONDITIONS.

THIS IS REALLY A BIG VICTORY SAID VIVIAN KUA UNION REPRESENTATIVE WHO LIVES IN THE SUMMIT BUILDING IN THE HAMILTON HEIGHTS OF HARLEM.

THIS IS REAL DIRECT MONETARY ISSUES TO ADDRESS PEOPLE'S ISSUES.

>> CAN WE TAKE A MOMENT, FOLLOWING UP ON YOUR A TO OBAMA AND TALK ABOUT THE OBAMA CENTER.

WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS ABOUT THAT?

I THINK IT'S AMAZING BECAUSE IT'S IN MY HOMETOWN.

>> LIKE SOME PEOPLE, I LIKED SEEING SOME OF THAT MONEY GOING TO OTHER THINGS BUT I THINK HE DESERVES IT AND IT IS MORE THAN A LIBRARY.

IT IS A CENTER DUE TO ITS DIGITAL ET CETERA.

IT'S WELL DONE.

>> I LOVE HOW THEY'RE OPENING IT UP, ENCOURAGING PEOPLE TO BARBECUE ON THE LAWNS AND I THINK IT REALLY REFLECTS THE OBAMA'S COMMUNITY SPIRIT.

AND I THINK IT'S GREAT.

>> IT'S BEAUTIFUL TO HAVE THIS IN THE BACKGROUND.

ONE OF THE FOLKS ON STAFF HERE, BRUCE, WENT TO VISIT AND SHOWED HIS PICTURES.

I CAN'T WAIT TO GO.

ANIRBAN, HAVE YOU BEEN OR ARE YOU GOING TO GO?

>> I HAVE NOT BEEN TO CHICAGO YET, EXCEPT FOR TRANSIT.

I WOULD LOVE TO GO TO CHICAGO.

I HAVE A VERY GOOD FRIEND THERE WHO IS A JAZZ MU MUSICIAN SO WHEN I VISIT I WILL DEFINITELY GO.

>> THAT IS IT FOR US IN THE STUDIO TONIGHT BEFORE WE GO, A SHOUTOUT TO WARREN, A FAITHFUL VIEWER EVER SINCE A CAMPUS VISIT TO COLGATE.

WARREN WOULD LIKE TO HEAR ABOUT CHANGES TO THE CONSTITUTION.

WE'LL TRY TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN, WARREN.

WE'D LOVE TO HEAR FROM THE REST OF YOU.

PLEASE WRITE TO THE ADDRESS ON YOUR SCREEN.

IF YOU WANT TO WATCH THE SHOW AGAIN OR SHARE IT ON SOCIAL MEDIA GO TO WCNY.ORG.

I'M NINA MOORE, FOR ALL OF US HERE AT "THE IVORY TOWER."

HAVE A GREAT TIGHT.