>> COMING UP NEXT, WE LOOK AT THE PRESIDENT'S WAR STRATEGY.

ALSO TONIGHT, WHY THE PUBLIC NO LONGER TRUSTS HIGHER EDUCATION.

AND DID THE ONONDAGA COUNTY EXECUTIVE VETO THE BILL OR NOT?

LET'S GET SMARTER WITH THE PROFESSORS OF "IVORY TOWER."

>> THIS PROGRAM IS BROUGHT TO YOU BY THE MEMBERS OF WCNY.

THANK YOU.

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> WELCOME BACK EVERYBODY.

THANKS FOR BEING HERE.

I'M NINA MOORE OF COLGATE UNIVERSITY.

JOINING ME AROUND THE TABLE TONIGHT, THE PROFESSORS: TARA ROSS OF ONONDAGA COMMUNITY COLLEGE.

ANIRBAN ACHARYA OF LEMOYNE COLLEGE.

BOB SPITZER OF SUNY CORTLAND WHO'S JOINING US ON ZOOM.

AND OUR NEWEST COLLEAGUE NORRELL EDWARDS OF LEMOYNE COLLEGE.

IF YOU'VE STRUGGLED TO KEEP UP WITH THE TWISTS AND TURNS IN THE IRAN WAR YOU'RE NOT ALONE.

IT'S BEEN A DIZZYING ON-AGAIN, OFF-AGAIN WAR.

WITH THE NOW-FAILED MEMORANDUM OF UNDERSTANDING BEING THE LATEST PLOT TWIST.

THIS ALL RAISES THE QUESTION... WHAT EXACTLY IS THE PRESIDENT'S STRATEGY FOR THE WAR?

NORMALLY WHEN WE TALK ABOUT ANY WAR STRATEGY WE TALK ABOUT THE OBJECTIVES OF THE WAR PLUS THE MILITARY ECONOMIC OR DIPLOMATIC MEANS TO ACHIEVE THOSE OBJECTIVES.

BOB, WHETHER IN THESE TERMS OR OTHERS, HOW DO YOU DESCRIBE THE PRESIDENT'S IRAN WAR STRATEGY?

>> I WOULD DESCRIBE THE PRESIDENT'S IRAN WAR STRATEGY AS A PARADE OF WONDERS.

THIS WAS A WAR OF CHOICE THAT TRUMP BEGAN IN LATE FEBRUARY OF THIS YEAR.

AND HIS STATED GOALS INCLUDED REGIME CHANGE, THAT FAILED.

THERE ARE NEW LEADERS IN IRAN BECAUSE WE KILLED OFF THE TOP LEADERS BUT THOSE WHO ARE NOW IN CHARGE ARE EVEN MORE HARD-LINE THAN THE MORE SENIOR LEADERS WE KILLED BY BOMBING.

THEY WANTED TO END IRAN'S NUCLEAR PROGRAM.

IRAN STILL HAS NUCLEAR MATERIAL.

THEY HAVE VOWED THAT THEY WILL NEVER GIVE UP NUCLEAR ENRICHMENT WHICH IS A DIFFERENT THING FROM DEVELOPING WEAPONS GRADE NUCLEAR MATERIAL.

TRUMP WANTED TO END ITS SUPPORT FOR THE HOUTHIS AND HEZBOLLAH.

THOSE GROUPS ARE STILL ACTIVE.

HE FAILED THERE.

AND HE WANTED TO DESTROY IRAN'S ATTACK CAPABILITIES.

WE HAVE INFLICTED GREAT DAMAGE ON IRAN MILITARILY BUT THEY HAVE DEMONSTRATED THAT THEIR ABILITY TO CONTROL THE STRAIT OF HORMUZ IS NOT HYPOTHETICAL.

THEY'RE NOW DOING IT.

THAT IS AN ESCALATION THAT WE HAVE NOT EXPERIENCED BEFORE THIS ALL BEGAN.

INSTEAD OF DEESCALATING, TRUMP IS CLIMBING THE ESCALATION LADDER.

AND THAT IS TRUE UP UNTIL RIGHT NOW AS I'M SPEAKING TO YOU.

AND WHAT BEGAN AS WHAT HE CONSIDERED A FOUR-DAY BLITZ IS NOW STRETCHING INTO A FIVE-MONTH SLIDE, WITH NO IMMEDIATE END IN SIGHT.

AND NOW WE HAVE MORE BAD NEWS, WHICH IS A CONSEQUENCE OF THIS WHOLE MILITARY MESS, WHICH IS THAT THE HOUTHIS HAVE NOW CLOSED OFF THE CLOSURE POINT IN THE RED SEA BECAUSE THAT WAS AN ALTERNATE ROUTE BY WHICH OIL WAS LEAVING THE MIDDLE EAST THE STRAIT OF HORMUZ CLOSED.

>> THAT'S DESPITE LEBANON'S PRESIDENT'S REPRESENTATIONS TO THE OPPOSITE, RIGHT.

HE WANTS SOMETHING QUITE DIFFERENT.

BUT ANIRBAN, TO BOB'S POINT ABOUT THERE BEING MULTIPLE OBJECTIVES.

IT'S NOT NECESSARY FOR THERE TO BE A SINGLE OBJECTIVE TO CONTINUE THIS QUOTE UNQUOTE STRATEGY, ISN'T IT?

ISN'T IT POSSIBLE FOR THE PRESIDENT TO PURSUE MULTIPLE STRATEGIES?

THE MOST IMPORTANT BEING ENSURING THAT IRAN DOES NOT HAVE A NUCLEAR WEAPON?

>> OF COURSE.

YOU KNOW, WAR IS-- MIGHT HAVE DIFFERENT OBJECTIVES BUT LET ME BACK UP A LITTLE BIT HERE AND KIND OF, YOU KNOW, SAY THAT WHEN WE SAY WAR OF CHOICE, THAT'S A SAN ADVERTISIZATION OF WHAT ACTUALLY-- SANITIZIZATION OF WHAT IS ACTUALLY HAPPENING.

WHAT WE ARE SEEING BY INTERNATIONAL LAW IT'S A WAR OF AGGRESSION LIKE RUSSIA DID ON UKRAINE.

SO THERE IS NO U.N.

SECURITY COUNCIL MEASURE DECLARING THIS WAR.

SO THIS WAS A WAR OF AGGRESSION.

AND NOW AFTER-- YES, MULTIPLE OBJECTIVES, WHICH OBJECTIVES ARE FILLED AND WHEN?

THIS IS A WAR WE HAVE WON 35 TIMES.

IT'S A VERY STRANGE KIND OF WAR.

SO IS IT NUCLEAR WEAPON?

I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S THE CASE, HOW YOU ARE WE GOING TO GET IT?

WILL THERE BE A GROUND INVASION?

DO WE HAVE PLANS FOR THAT?

8,000 TROOPS ARE DEPLOYED.

THAT'S A RIDICULOUSLY SMALL NUMBER.

MAYBE SAVING IRANIANS FROM THE REGIME.

THAT HAS THE NOT HAPPENING.

HOW DO WE SUGGEST THAT IS THE CASE WHEN THERE HAVE BEEN BOMBING IN CHILDREN SCHOOLS, IN THE PAST YEAR, INSTITUTE, A MASSIVELY WONDERFUL VIR LOGICAL AND RESEARCH CENTER, ATTACK ON PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES.

HOW ARE WE GOING TO SAY AT THAT TIME WE ARE DOING THIS TO SAVE THE IRANIAN PEOPLE AND WHAT IS THE THIRD ONE?

I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT THE THIRD ONE IS.

SO AT THIS POINT I'M NOT SURE WHAT-- LIKE AGAIN, ACCORDING TO JOHN FROM CHICAGO AND ROBERT PAPE THESE SCHOLARS THAT STUDY THESE CONFLICTS.

THEY'RE FLUMMOXED AS TO WHAT THE OBJECTIVES ARE.

THERE ARE MULTIPLE OBJECTIVES AND THEY KEEP SHIFTING AND WE DON'T KNOW THE OBJECTIVE TODAY VERSUS TOMORROW.

AGAIN WE HAVE WON THIS WAR 35 TIMES.

SHOULD WE NEED TO WIN IT THREE MORE TIMES IF HOW MANY TIMES DO WE NEED TO WIN THE WAR?

>> LET ME CHALLENGE YOU ON YOUR INITIAL POINT, YOUR TOP LINE POINT OF THIS BEING A WAR OF AGGRESSION AND THINK ABOUT CONTEXT.

TARA, THE CONTEXT HERE IS THAT AMERICA HAS COME TO ALLY WITH ITS STRONGEST ALLY, ISRAEL BRUTALLY ATTACKED ON OCTOBER P BY HAD MASS.

ISN'T THAT ENOUGH REASON TO ENSURE THAT IRAN ISN'T CAPABLE OF DOING THAT AGAIN?

>> WELL, IT CERTAINLY IS, BUT AT WHAT POINT IS ENOUGH ENOUGH?

I MEAN IF YOU THINK ABOUT WHAT ISRAEL ALONE HAS DONE IN THE REGION, IN TERMS OF TAKING COMPLETE, PRETTY MUCH COMPLETE CONTROL OF THE WHOLE GAZA AREA, IT HAS MOVED INTO LEBANON.

SO ISRAEL, ON ITS OWN, SEEMS TO HAVE ENSURED THAT IN ITS OWN TERRITORY AND SURROUNDING TERRITORY, IT HAS CONTROL.

WE ENTER INTO THIS WAR AGAINST IRAN AND SUPPOSEDLY TO HELP ENSURE THAT ISRAEL IS SAFE.

WELL, WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME IN THE RECENT CONVERSATIONS ABOUT YES, WE'VE WON THE WAR, THAT YOU HEARD ISRAEL EVEN MENTIONED?

THAT SEEMS TO NO LONGER BE WHAT OUR CONCERN IS.

AND SO AS ANIRBAN HAS SAID, YOU HAVE THESE SHIFTING MOTIVATIONS AND SHIFTING GOALS.

BUT WE DON'T SEEM TO EVER REALLY ACHIEVE THEM, ALTHOUGH WE HAVE WON THE WAR, MORE THAN A FEW TIMES.

>> OKAY, NORRELL TO BOB'S EARLIER POINT, IS THIS A BLUNDERING STRATEGY IN YOUR VIEW?

>> I MEAN I THINK IT IS CERTAINLY A CONFUSING STRATEGY AND ALSO IT DOESN'T REALLY HOLD UP TO AMERICA FIRST, RIGHT?

WE'VE TALKED A LOT ABOUT SORT OF THE INTERNATIONAL ASPECT OF THIS, BUT WHAT ABOUT, YOU KNOW, WHAT IS HAPPENING AT HOME BECAUSE OF THIS WAR IN TERMS OF GAS PRICES, YOU KNOW, THINKING ABOUT INFLATION, THE ECONOMY, I THINK 14 OR 18, YOU KNOW, THE NUMBER HAS SHIFTED RECENTLY, SERVICE MEMBERS HAVE BEEN KILLED IN THIS WAR.

450 SERVICE MEMBERS ARE INJURED.

AND WE HAVE SPENT NEARLY SORT OF ALMOST 50 BILLION, RIGHT?

I THINK IT HAS TO BE CONSIDERED, TO TARA'S POINT WHEN IS ENOUGH ENOUGH?

WHAT ABOUT AMERICA AND TRUMP'S IDEAS ABOUT AMERICA FIRST?

>> BOB, I WANT TO FINISH WITH YOU AND WE ONLY HAVE ABOUT A MINUTE LEFT AND TO NORRELL'S POINT TO THE DOMESTIC SIDE OF THINGS, CAN YOU SAY QUICKLY WHAT YOU THINK IS DRIVING THE QUOTE UNQUOTE STRATEGY?

>> TRUMP AT THIS POINT WANTS TO SAVE HIS REPUTATION.

HE DOESN'T WANT TO CONCEDE ANYTHING RESEMBLING DEFEAT.

AND THE PROBLEM IS HE IS GOING IN THE WRONG DIRECTION BECAUSE HE WANTS OUT OF THIS.

I THINK HE HAS GOT TO REALIZE THAT HE SIMPLY IS DIGGING DEEPER IN A HOLE THAT HE IS MAKING IT HARDER FOR HIMSELF TO GET OUT OF.

AND I WOULD ADD THAT IN ADDITION TO GETTING STUCK IN THIS QUAGMIRE IN THE MIDDLE EAST, THE VERY THING HE SAID HE WOULD NEVER DO WHEN HE RAN FOR PRESIDENT THE SECOND TIME, HE IS DEPLETING AMERICA'S BOUTIQUE WEAPONS SUPPLY AND AMERICAN BASES IN THE MIDDLE EAST HAVE ALSO SUFFERED SIGNIFICANT DAMAGE.

A FACT THAT HAS NOT GOTTEN A LOT OF ATTENTION IN THE AMERICAN PRESS.

>> IT WOULD TAKE A LOT OF MONEY TO REBUILD THAT.

NOW TO MOVE EVEN CLOSER TO HOME.

FOR ALL OF US AT THE TABLE AND BOB AS WELL.

PUBLIC TRUST IN HIGHER EDUCATION IS AT AN ALL-TIME LOW.

A RECENT REPORT OUT OF YALE UNIVERSITY SUGGESTS THAT HIGHER EDUCATION HAS ONLY ITSELF TO BLAME.

HIGH TUITION COSTS.

POLITICAL BIAS.

LIMITS ON FREE SPEECH.

GRADE INFLATION.

AND ADMINISTRATIVE BLOAT ARE JUST SOME OF THE AREAS WHERE COLLEGES ARE SAID TO HAVE FALLEN SHORT.

BY THIS REPORT.

TONIGHT, WE WANT TO DIG INTO WHETHER SOME OR ALL OF THIS IS TRUE.

AND WHAT, IF ANYTHING, CAN BE DONE ABOUT IT.

SO, NORRELL HAS HIGHER EDUCATION FALLEN SHORT AS THE REPORT CLAIMS?

>> I THINK THAT'S, LIKE MANY OF YOUR QUESTIONS, THE ANSWER IS COMPLEX.

BUT THAT'S-- >> THAT'S GOOD.

>> I WILL TRY TO SAY AS MUCH AS I CAN.

YALE'S REPORT IS MOSTLY FOCUSED INTERNALLY ON YALE AND YALE HAS AN ENDOWMENT THAT MOST SCHOOLS CANNOT MATCH.

PUBLIC OPINION ON HIGHER ED HAS BEEN ON THE DECLINE FOR YEARS NOW.

IN PART, IT HAS BEEN A MISMATCH OF INSTITUTIONS AND HOW THEY HAVE EXPANDED RIGHT?

COLLEGE ENROLLMENT PEAKED MAYBE IN 2010 OR THEREABOUT AND IT'S INTERESTING TO SEE THAT IN THIS CURRENT MOMENT, WITH THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION THAT HAS HAS ALSO CHANGED SO MUCH OF THE LANDSCAPE, RIGHT?

HE HAS CAPITALIZED FOR HIS AGENDA IN WAYS THAT IS MOLT ULTIMATELY GOING TO CREATE A BRAIN DRAIN AND SOMETHING CARIBBEAN AND OTHER COUNTRIES IN THE GLOBAL SOUTH HAVE SEEN FOR DECADES.

AND SO I THINK THAT IS SOMETHING TO CONSIDER IN THAT THE RESTRICTION ON RESEARCH FUNDS AND RESEARCH INNOVATION IS ALSO GOING TO SORT OF HINDER THE HIGHER EDUCATION LANDSCAPE.

>> TARA, IT IS SAID THAT EVEN A BROKEN CLOCK IS RIGHT TWICE A DAY.

LET'S SAY THAT TRUMP IS UNFAIRLY GOING AFTER HIGHER ED INSTITUTIONS, DOES THAT ALSO MEAN THERE IS NOTHING TO THIS YALE REPORT ABOUT TUITION COSTS, ABOUT BIAS, ABOUT LIMITS ON FREE SPEECH?

>> IT ABSOLUTELY DOES NOT MEAN THAT.

MANY OF THE POINTS THAT WERE MADE ARE POINTS THAT COULD APPLY TO MANY COLLEGES AND UNIVERSITIES ACROSS THE LANDSCAPE.

YOU KNOW, CERTAINLY ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WAS MENTIONED WAS, YOU KNOW, THE WILLINGNESS TO BOTH, IN TERMS OF SPEAKERS COMING ON CAMPUS BUT ALSO FACT STAFF, ET CETERA, HAVE A DIVERSITY OF VIEWPOINTS.

AND IN SOME CASES THAT IS AN AREA WHERE WE HAVE FALLEN SHORT AT ALL LEVELS.

CERTAINLY INCREASING COST OF HIGHER HIGHER ED, WHICH IS CONNECTED WITH ADMINISTRATIVE BLOAT IS A MAJOR ISSUE ALL ACROSS THE BOARD.

THOSE ARE PROBLEMS THAT NEED TO BE ADDRESSED.

AND NEED TO BE ADDRESSED KEEPING IN MIND WHAT YALE HAS TO ADDRESS THESE ISSUES VERSUS WHAT, SAY, A PUBLIC INSTITUTION STATE INSTITUTION HAS TO ADDRESS THESE ISSUES VERSUS IN MY CASE, A COMMUNITY COLLEGE HAS TO ADDRESS THESE ISSUES IN TERMS OF HIRING ABILITY, ET CETERA.

ALL OF THOSE THINGS ARE NOT EXACTLY THE SAME.

YET WE ALL SORT OF GET TARRED BY THE SAME PROBLEMS THAT SOMEONE LIKE YALE HAS.

>> ONE OF THE PROBLEMS THAT SEEMS TO BE CONSIDERED ANIRBAN IS THERE IS A PREBOND RESISTANCE-- PREPONDERANCE OF UNIVERSITY FACULTY 70 TO 80% OF MOST LIBERAL ARTS COLLEGES ARE COMPOSED ARE FOLKS WHO ARE REGISTERED DEMOCRATS, FACULTY FOLKS.

DOES THAT LEND CREDENCE TO THE IDEA THAT THERE IS POLITICAL BIAS?

>> LOOK, WHO YOU ARE REGISTERED TO, I DON'T THINK COMES OUT IN MY AMERICAN POLITICS CASE.

I AM EXTREMELY-- >> HOW ABOUT YOUR MATH CLASS?

>> YOUR MATH CLASS DOESN'T CARE ABOUT WHETHER I'M A DEMOCRAT OR REPUBLICAN, RIGHT?

I THINK THAT PROFESSORS WHEN THEY TEACH IN CLASS, THEY ARE NOT-- THEY SHOULD NOT BE, YOU KNOW, AT LEAST THAT'S WHAT THE TRAINING PEDAGOGY CAL TRAINING TO HAVE EVERYONE IN YOUR CLASS ABLE TO SPEAK TO DIFFERENT TOPICS.

IN MY CASE, I ACTUALLY ASK WHO IS PROGUN AND ANTIGUN AND I MAKE THEM ARGUE THE OPPOSITE POINT IN CLASS.

SO AS A PROFESSOR, I DON'T THINK OUR POLITICAL IDEOLOGIES LEAK OUT IMMEDIATELY IN KIND OF INDOCTRINATION OF OUR STUDENTS.

IF SOMEONE IS SAYING THAT, THEY REALLY DON'T KNOW HOW PROFESSORS WORK.

NOW THE SECOND PART I WOULD SAY THIS, YES, AS YOU KNOW MORE, AS YOU CRITICALLY LOOK AT THE DIFFERENT PARTS OF THE WORLD, READ DIFFERENT KINDS OF LITERATURE, YOU TEND TO BE A LITTLE BIT MORE OPEN MINDED THAN CONSERVATIVE.

THAT'S THE TENDENCY OF HIGHER EDUCATION, RIGHT?

SO NOW IF YOU SAY WHY CAN I NOT TAKE A CAT-FOR-A WALK?

YOU CAN BECAUSITE IS A CAT, RIGHT?

SIMILARLY THE NATURE OF HIGHER EDUCATION IS THAT YOU BECOME MUCH MORE OPEN MINDED AND MUCH MORE CRITICAL IN YOUR THINKING AND QUESTION THINGS.

IN FREE SPEECH, IN AC ACADEMIA WE ARE NOT ABOUT FREE SPEECH.

WE ARE ABOUT VETTED PEER REVIEWED KNOWLEDGE.

IF SOMEONE SAYS IN MY CLASS I'M GOING TO PRAISE HITLER FOR THE HOLOCAUST OF THE JEWS AND THAT'S MY FREE SPEECH AND I DON'T THINK HOLOCAUST HAPPENS, CAN I NOT ALLOW THAT IN MY CLASS BECAUSE THAT IS NOT FEETED PEER REVIEWED RESEARCH, RIGHT?

ONE MIGHT THINK ABOUT THESE THINGS MORE CRITICALLY BUT I AGREE WITH THE WHOLE IDEA-OF-THE, YOU KNOW, GREAT INFLATION, I AGREE WITH THE IDEA OF THE TREMENDOUS AMOUNTS OF MONEY, HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS AND THAT'S WHY WE SHOULD NOT SPEND MONEY ON WAR AND SPEND MONEY ON EDUCATION.

THERE YOU GO.

>> STAYING WHERE WE ARE RIGHT NOW, TALKING ABOUT EDUCATION, AND BY THE WAY, I WILL NOT BELIEVE THAT YOUR DISCUSSION ABOUT GUNS IS GROUNDED UNLESS YOU ARE ASSIGNING BOB'S BOOKS.

SO BOB, I WANT TO TURN TO YOU AND ASK NOW.

EVERYBODY AT THE TABLE IS SAYING MAYBE THERE REALLY ISN'T A PROBLEM HERE.

SO WHY IS IT THAT PUBLIC TRUST HAS DECLINED TO 35% FROM 65% 10 YEARS AGO.

THAT'S A PRETTY BIG DROP.

TO WHAT DO YOU ATTRIBUTE THAT?

>> WELL, I THINK THERE ARE AT LEAST TWO FACTORS THAT PLAY THAT ARE SIGNIFICANT AND I'LL ADD THAT HIGHER EDUCATION IS SUBJECT TO CRITICISM.

MANY OF THE CRITICISMS ARE LEGITIMATE.

BUT I DO THINK THEY MISS THE POINT THAT AN ANIRBAN SO IMPORTANTLY MAKE THAT FACULTY MEMBERS ARE HIRED TO TEACH THEIR SUBJECT MATTER, THEIR SPECIALTY AND THAT'S WHAT YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO BE DOING.

AND THAT'S WHAT THE OVERWHELMING MAJORITY OF FACULTY DO.

BUT TRUST IN EDUCATION, I THINK IS DOWN FOR AT LEAST A COUPLE OF REASONS.

ONE IS BECAUSE POLITICAL LEADERS CAN DRIVE OPINION AND HIGHER EDUCATION HAS SUFFERED RELENTLESS PUMMELING.

SOME OF IT JUSTIFIED, BUT MOST OF IT, IN MY VIEW, NOT, FROM POLITICAL LEADERS IN THE LAST DECADE OR SO.

THAT DRIVES DOWN PUBLIC OPINION.

AND I THINK PARENTS AND FAMILIES ARE PUT OFF BY THE SHEER COST OF HIGHER EDUCATION.

ALTHOUGH I WILL NOTE THAT THE AVERAGE OPPORTUNITY LOAN DEBT OF THE AVERAGE FOUR-YEAR STUDENT GRADUATED FROM A COLLEGE, IS ABOUT $35,000.

OKAY?

NOW THAT'S A FAIR AMOUNT OF MONEY BUT THAT'S BARELY THE COST OF A NEW CAR.

AND WHEN YOU CONSIDER THE BENEFITS AND REWARDS OF A COLLEGE EDUCATION, TO ME, THAT'S A PRETTY GOOD DOLLAR INVESTMENT.

AND THERE IS ALSO BEEN MUCH CONCERN ABOUT COLLEGE GRADUATES NOT BEING ABLE TO FIND WORK AFTER GRADUATING, YOU KNOW, LIVING AT HOME WITH THEIR PARENTS FOR YEARS AND SO ON AND THAT'S THE DEFINITE CONCERN.

BUT THE ECONOMY IS CHANGING SO RAPIDLY, THAT THE PEOPLE WHO ARE GOING TO BE BEST ABLE TO ADAPT TO IT, THIS RAPIDLY CHANGING ECONOMY ARE GOING TO BE THOSE WITH GREATER EDUCATION.

HIGHER EDUCATION IS NOT FOR EVERYBODY.

AND THERE ARE LOTS OF GREAT THINGS TO DO AFTER YOU LEAVE HIGH SCHOOL IF YOU DON'T WANT TO GO TO COLLEGE.

BUT FOR THOSE WHO DO WANT TO GO, IT'S STILL A TERRIFIC BARGAIN AND A GREAT THING TO DO.

>> OKAY, SO WE ARE ACTUALLY OUT OF TIME.

BUT I DO WANT TO ASK THIS QUESTION, AND NORRELL COULD YOU GIVE US A VERY QUICK ANSWER?

THE REPORT SAYS THAT UNIVERSITIES HAVE ESSENTIALLY FORGOTTEN WHAT THEIR PURPOSE IS.

THAT THERE IS A MIX OF EDUCATING BUT ALSO SOCIALIZING STUDENTS.

WHAT IS OUR JOB AS PROFESSORS?

TO EDUCATE, SOCIALIZE, DO BOTH OR WHAT?

>> I BELIEVE IT IS OUR JOB TO DO BOTH; HOWEVER, WE MUST REMEMBER THAT EDUCATION WAS HISTORICALLY FOR THE WEALTHY AND DUE TO SORT OF LIKE OUR CURRENT ECONOMIC LANDSCAPE, IT IS MOVING BACK IN THAT DIRECTION.

AND SO INSTITUTIONS HAVE TO FIGURE OUT WHAT THEIR MISSION IS ALIGNED AND WHAT IT IS.

>> THANK YOU FOR THAT.

NOW, HERE IS A VERY INTERESTING STORY.

SHORTLY AFTER ANNOUNCING HIS PLANS TO VETO A BILL THAT WOULD IMPOSE TERM LIMITS ON HIS OFFICE ONONDAGA COUNTY EXECUTIVE RYAN MCMAHON MISTAKENLY DID THE EXACT OPPOSITE.

HE SIGNED A LETTER APPROVING THE BILL INSTEAD.

MOMENTS LATER HE SIGNED ANOTHER LETTER THAT VETOED THE BILL.

SO, I'LL ASK A VERY SIMPLE QUESTION: DID HE APPROVE THE BILL OR DID HE VETO THE BILL?

>> AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED, HE SIGNED THE BILL.

I RESPECT THE FACT THAT ANYBODY CAN MAKE A MISTAKE.

AND IF WE HAD SIMPLY HAD, YOU KNOW, TWO FORMS AND I ACCIDENTALLY PUT MY SIGNATURE TO THE WRONG FORM, THAT MIGHT MAKE SENSE.

BUT THESE ARE LETTERS, WHICH MEANS SOMEONE HAD TO TYPE UP THE LETTER TO STATE THAT, YES, I AM IN SUPPORT OF THIS OF TERM LIMITS.

SO THIS IS WHERE I HAVE A PROBLEM.

I CAN SEE TWO FORMS SITTING RIGHT THERE TOGETHER I ACCIDENTALLY SIGNED THE WRONG FORM BUT SOMEBODY HAD TO TYPE UP LETTER SAYING I SUPPORT THIS.

THAT, TO ME DOESN'T SOUND SO MUCH LIKE A MISTAKE ANYMORE.

I WOULD SAY GO WITH THE FIRST ONE SUBMITTED.

>> OKAY, SO THE EXECUTIVE HAS COME OUT, ANIRBAN, TO SAY, I THINK WITHIN THE PAST 14 HOURS, ACCORDING TO POST STANDARD REPORTING, WHICH IS ALWAYS EXCELLENT, THAT HE WAS GIVEN A STACK OF PAPERS BY HIS ATTORNEY AND HE ISY SLINGS SAYING IT IS THE ATTORNEY'S FAULT.

YOUR THOUGHTS ABOUT THAT.

>> WELL, TONGUE IN CHEEK ANSWER, THIS IS THE SIGN THAT YOU SHOULD ACTUALLY HAVE TERM LIMITS.

BUT, YOU KNOW, A STACK OF PAPERS YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO SIGN, YOU ARE THE COUNTY EXECUTIVE, YOU ARE NOT LOOKING AT THE STACK OF PAPERS YOU ARE SIGNING?

AND NOW YOU ARE SAYING OH YOU KNOW, MY ASSISTANT DID THE MISTAKE?

THAT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT A RESPONSIBLE LEADER SHOULD SAY.

>> THE ATTORNEY.

>> NOT THE ASSISTANT.

>> ATTORNEY OR WHATEVER, RIGHT?

SO YES, I DO UNDERSTAND, LOOK PEOPLE KNEW THAT HE WANTED TO VETO IT.

AND NOW, YOU KNOW, HE ACCIDENTALLY HAS SIGNED IT.

THE DEMOCRATS NOW HAVE THE SIGNED LETTER.

THIS WILL PLAY OUT IN POLITICAL COURTS, BUT MORALLY,ETHICALLY I DO THINK THAT THIS SHOULD GO TO THE VOTERS AND THE VOTERS SHOULD DECIDE WHAT AND HOW MUCH TERM LIMITS SHOULD V. I'M PERSONALLY IN FAVOR OF TERM LIMITS AND AT LEAST TRPTS OF THREE OR FOUR-YEAR TERMS, 12 YEARS IN OFFICE AND THEN AFTER THAT... SO YOU KNOW, YOU SHOULD LOOK AND READ WHAT YOU SIGN IS WHAT I AM GOING TO SAY TO THE PERSON WHO MAKES LAWS.

>> ALL RIGHT.

SO, NORRELL LET ME PUSH BACK IN THE OTHER DIRECTION.

THE COUNTY EXECUTIVE SENT A VETO LETTER 19 MINUTES AFTER INITIALLY SIGNING IT.

SO THINKING ABOUT THE ETHICS OF THIS, DOESN'T IT MAKE SENSE THAT WE WOULD ALL LOOK AND UNDERSTAND THAT HE INTENDED TO VETO IT AND WHOEVER SCREWED UP, SCREWED UP AND IN 19 MINUTES HE CORRECTED HIS MISTAKE?

>> NO BECAUSE THE LAW IS BASED ON DOCUMENTS.

SO ACTUALLY I LOOKED A LITTLE INTO THIS.

LAST YEAR SOUTH DAKOTA'S GOVERNOR ACCIDENTALLY VETOED $35 MILLION IN HOUSING FUNDS BUT HE HAD ONLY MEANT TO DO A LINE ITEM VETO SO THEY HAD THIS SAME SORT OF WHAT DO WE DO AND THE ATTORNEY GENERAL DETERMINED THE WRITTEN MESSAGE IS THE CONTROLLING DOCUMENT RATHER THAN THE MISMARKED VERSION OF THE BILL WHICH WAS THE VISUAL AID SO FOR PARALLELLING THIS, RIGHT, THE WRITTEN DOCUMENT IS THE FIRST THAT HE GAVE IN.

>> BOB WE'VE GOT A MINUTE.

WHAT SAY YOU?

>> I THINK YOU CAN MAKE A FAIR LEGAL ARGUMENT EITHER WAY BUT THE LEGAL ISSUANCE OF THE LETTER, WHICH HAS LEGAL IMPORT SEWER SEEDS THE INTENT BEHIND IT AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED.

AND UNLESS THERE IS A PROIX IN ONONDAGA COUNTY OR STATE LAW, A PROVISION THAT SAYS A FOLLOW-UP DOCUMENT ALSO A LEGAL ISSUANCE CAN COUNTER MAND A PREVIOUS ONE AND I HAVE A FEELING THE ANSWER IS NO, IT SEEMS AS THOUGH THE FIRST LETTER WOULD APPLY AND AGAIN, IT DOESN'T SIMPLY IMPLEMENT TERM LIMITS.

>> IT TAKES IT TO THE BALLOT.

THE OTHER ISSUE-- >> THAT'S NOT AN UNREASONABLE.

>> THE OTHER QUESTION OF COURSE, WHETHER THE ELECTION COMMISSIONER, THE REPUBLICAN ONE CAN DENY PUTTING IT ON THE BALLOT BECAUSE HIS ACCEPTS OF THE INTENT.

WELL, NOW IT'S TIME FOR OUR GRADE BOOKS.

AND WE ARE GOING TO MALES EVEN THOUGH THEY COMPRISE 68% OF THE WORKING POPULATION.

>> OKAY.

ANIRBAN.

>> MY F GOES TO THE CDC CUTS THAT HAVE LEFT THE U.S.

LESS PREPARED FOR DISEASE OUTBREAKS.

FORMER TOP CITY OFFICIALS SAY THIS RAPID IS MANTLING OF THE U.S.

PUBLIC HEALTH SYSTEM AT ALL LEVELS MEANS THE U.S.

IS IN WORSE SHAPE NOW THAN WE WERE BEFORE THE COVID PANDEMIC.

SEEMS MORE LIKE MAKE AMERICA SICK AGAIN.

>> BOB.

>> I'M GIVING A F TO THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION FOR DISMANTLING FEDERAL ENERGY EFFICIENCY PROGRAMS.

THERE IS NO DOWNSIDE TO IMPROVING ENERGY EFFICIENCY, EXTENDING TO ENVIRONMENTAL AND ECONOMIC BENEFITS.

NOW FOR THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION , APPARENTLY IF THERE IS A HOLE IN THE "TITANIC," THEIR REMEDY IS TO MAKE IT BIGGER.

>> NORRELL.

>> MY F TO A.I.

DETECTION TOOLS AND I'M WORRIED THAT WILL TRIGGER A.I.

WITCH HUNTS.

>> NOW GOOD NEWS.

>> MY A GOES TO THE CITY OF LOS ANGELES AND THE JAPANESE AMERICAN VETERANS ASSOCIATION WHICH RECENTLY CELEBRATED THE 80th ANNIVERSARY OF WHAT THEY CALL THE DAY OF AFFIRMATION.

ON JULY 15, 80 YEARS AGO PRESIDENT TRUMAN GAVE THE 100th BATTALION 442nd COMBAT TEAM ITSth PRESIDENTIAL DISTINGUISHED UNIT CITATION.

THIS ALL JAPANESE AMERICAN UNIT WAS THE MOST DECORATED UNIT IN THE U.S.

MILITARY HISTORY.

>> ANIRBAN.

>> MY A GOES TO CHARLIE ROSSI AND HIS TEAM SPENDING 50 YEARS BUILDING THIS AMAZING AND EXTRAORDINARY STAR ACCESS, A NAKED EYE OBSERVATORY IN NEW MEXICO IN IT'S FINAL DESIGNS.

RISES UP 11 STORIES AND IT FRAMES THE POLARIS.

WHEN IT IS FINISH WE SHOULD ALL GO SEE IT.

>> BOB, I'M GIVING AN A TO TEXAS REPUBLICAN SENATOR JOHN CORNIN FOR THREATENING TO BLOCK TWO TRUMP ADMINISTRATION AMBASSADOR APPOINTMENTS UNLESS THE ADMINISTRATION RELEASES 1.3 BILLION FUNDING FOR AIDS RELIEF IN AFRICA.

MILLIONS OF LIVES ARE AT STAKE.

>> A TO THE EVERSONS FOOD TRUCK FRIDAYS AS I'M HEADED THERE LATER TODAY.

>> THE FOOD TRUCKS.

I ABSOLUTELY LOVE THERE IS A NEW ONE MY FRIEND HAS STARTED.

SO YOUR FAVORITE FOOD TRUCK IS?

>> OH MAN, DON'T PUT ME ON THE SPOT.

>> OKAY.

WELL, YOU KNOW, THEY HAVE THEM ALL OVER THE PLACES NOW.

>> THEY'RE SO GOOD.

THERE IS A TACO ONE I CAN'T THINK OF THE NAME OF.

>> THAT'S ON SALINA STREET.

>> THE LOBSTER ROLE.

>> OH MY GOSH?

IN FRONT OF IVERSON?

>> THEY HAVE ROTATING ONES THAT COME ON FRIDAYS.

>> HAVE YOU TO CHECK THE STREET FINDER SCHEDULE TO KNOW EXACTLY WHERE THEY ARE OR YOU CAN FOLLOW YOUR FAVORITE FOOD TRUCK ONLINE.

I ABSOLUTELY LOVE THEM.

WELL, THAT'S IT FOR THE TALK AROUND THE TABLE TONIGHT.

BEFORE WE GO, OUR THANKS TO MARY AND TO INGRID OF HOMER.

FOR SHARING HOW MUCH THEY APPRECIATE INSIGHTS FROM BOB SPITZER AND NORRELL EDWARDS.

THEY ARE EXCITED THE BOB IS BACK AND LITTLE EXCITED TO SEE THAT NORRELL IS STARTING WITH US AND I AM AS WELL.

ALSO TO HARVEY OF HAM, THANKS FOR SHARING LITTLE "IVORY TOWER" PAINTING.

HARVEY DIDN'T SAY EXACTLY WHAT HIS MESSAGE WAS IN SHARING IT BUT I'M SO GLAD THAT HE DID.

WE HOPE TO HEAR FROM THE REST OF YOU.

PLEASE WRITE TO THE ADDRESS ON YOUR SCREEN.

IF YOU WANT TO WATCH THE SHOW AGAIN OR SHARE IT WITH SOMEONE ELSE GO TO WCNY.ORG.

I'M NINA MOORE.

FOR ALL OF US HERE AT "IVORY TOWER," WE HOPE HAVE YOU A GREAT NIGHT.

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